Wayward pigs

Lisa: How long before the pig is returned to his pen? You might want to FF and see how long the animal is out of the pen before we decide about how to handle this. Jeff

Well, Dan and Marcus at Crossville said this happened in one of the pens and they should put him back in his correct pen in about 6-7 hours when they feed (it is about 11 at night when he crosses over). My main question for the moment is can I exit my observing during the middle of a 4 hour observation block and not mess anything up? Just say terminate/exit session? Lisa

Lisa: Why don't you do this: Mark both of the # five pigs as being out of the pen and then finish the recording.

or Exit the current ODF file and make a new one that reflect when you exited. i.e. 9 scans to go. If you just end the OBS session now it will save the information that you have already entered. Tell Dr. Kattesh what has happened and see how he wants to proceed. 

You can either act like the lights went from when the pig moved into the other pen or treat the periods when the animals are mixed as missing data. Julie thinks Dr. Kattesh should decide about how to proceed. Jeff

Hey, I'm observing my videotapes and we are still deciding what to do with the escape artist. But my question is, I don't think I understand the labeling of times of the files, especially the start time, for instance, for pens 30/32, start time for D1A is 10:00 which is fine, I begin observing at 10:00, then at the end, time has run out and then I start D1B and my time on the videotape is 14:15 not 14:00 like your file description says, what am I doing wrong?? (I've been typing in my real time - 14:15 as the start time in the independent variables). Thanks, Lisa

I've actually gotten through a complete tape and should I send it on to you? I want to make sure it looks OK. Are you just transforming the data in another program so it is on an Excel spreadsheet? I've worked through a couple more almost all the way, the escape artist one is giving me trouble since Kattesh told me to treat the No. 5 pig from pen 38 as not missing from the pen since I can still see him in pen 40 but at one point he goes behind the water pipe that is in the way and both no. 5 pigs come into view, I can guess which one is the real deal but not with certainty and before that the imposter No. 5 gets into minor fights with a couple of resident pigs at the feeder. Is that a consideration for considering him as out of the pen and considering the resident No. 5 as possibly not visible or too dark for the 7 hours this confusion persists? (since I can't say imposter was fighting a pig in his own pen?) I've got to talk to Kattesh about it and understood the thinking on getting the data since I could still see him but know with the confusion and fighting point of view I don't want to mess up my behavioral data.

Lisa: I use the Observer software with a hardware key to get the data into an Excel sheet. Right now my key is dead, they are sending me a new one and hopefully it should be here soon. I can't change anything on your program until we get the key, that's why we are having the one extra scan sample. I will email you once I get the key, or you can send me what you have right now if you want.

I'm not going to ASAS nor to the regional conference with Julie in September. Are you going to the regional conference in September? This would be a good chance to talk with Julie about the impostor No. 5 pig question. There are many ways of handling these types of issues, it is important to feel comfortable with the how they are resolved. Impostor pig questions like this are difficult, they make a bit more sense after one has run data for 20 years or so. How one chooses to deal with these issues is based upon many factors, i.e. personal experience, preferences, cost/benefit decisions. Julie might be able to help explain the Kattesh viewpoint on this one, she helps me to understand how the data are handled in these circumstances.

Thanks, I noticed once I pushed a wrong key in the Observer main screen and it said I needed some type of key and to install it before trying to do whatever it was I pushed in the first place - probably that function?? Too bad about Sept. I have to be here, Kattesh is hosting it in Knoxville and me and a couple of other people are going to be designated chauffers (sp??) for the weekend. Would enjoy seeing you again. I'll just keep watching and send you what I've got when you get the key. So you just tell the Observer program to export data into Excel by use of a hardware key? I don't know exactly what a hardware key is - just the device needed to convert the data into the spreadsheet? Lisa

Lisa: What did you do before? This happened with the first set of pigs didn't it? I think the missing from pen is a good solution to this. How are you doing on the tapes? Jeff

Actually stopped watching the first tape at that point for a reason and after getting the VCR back I remember why - the first time there were 2 pens of 6 so when number 3 went under the fence there were 2 Pig 3s in the pen, not confusing at first but a few hours after he had been in the wrong pen, at some point lost who was who, they both were piled in a heap of pigs and one of them comes out but I don't know which one!!

The original idea was to continue viewing him for his maintenance behaviors as done previously because we could see him but don't you agree that his behavior is not going to be the same when he is in a new environment - standing up more sniffing the new smells, not eating as much because no one will let him eat, etc. So I should just say not in pen for him and ignore him right??

Same for this pig even though he is marked clearly differently than the other 3 pigs?

Otherwise tapes are getting done at record speed, I'm sitting in front of the VCR and TV for about 6-8 hours a day since Jennifer will need my VCR in Nov. I'm getting them done and should be done with all of them within 2 weeks. I may have to get glasses in 2 weeks also but hey, it has to get done. Then I'm off to the lab after that until Christmas. I've gotten really good with the Observer program and no problems now with the VCR or program since we used the UPS unit and your new programs.

Please let me know what you and Julie think about this happening twice where a pig gets into another pen. Just say missing from pen and ignore fights between wayward pig and the penmates that should be there, right?

Lisa: Sorry I took a while to get back to you. Below is what Julie is thinking. It sounds like you are on the right track. Looking forward to working on the data and seeing what happened. I hope you are taking some breaks, Jeff

> Yes I told her to do that and also mark the pens that the pigs went into as their behavior may be off too.>

> >Lisa wants to know if it's OK to mark the missing pig as out of the pen, I
> >think this is the way to go with this. Do you have any thoughts on this? Jeff

Thanks Jeff, helps a lot. I've now analyzed those tapes. The only thing I have left are reviewing some of the first tapes for fights since I didn't do that right off the bat. How should I score these after I get this data? What does length of fight have to do with the scoring I thought it was simply who fought who and who won.

I'll be sending you two disks soon in the mail if that is what you want of all the Observer files for the last two tapings. Probably be another week though. Same address as on your email message?

Lisa: I think you should get all the fight data togather first. Once you have all the data then you can graph it and see what's going on. How many fights total, how many fights before and after phase two of the project. Once you get the raw data then you can figure out what to do with it a bit better. Jeff

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